Free Range Naturism

Naturism => Free Range Naturism => Topic started by: Peter S on July 20, 2015, 07:26:28 PM

Title: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Peter S on July 20, 2015, 07:26:28 PM
From the Manchester Evening News:
Police were called to reports of three men stripped completely NAKED washing their clothes in a city centre fountain.
A security guard saw the trio around 10am Sunday morning cleaning their clothing in the Cathedral Gardens water feature, and called 999.
CCTV footage of the clean-conscious men showed one man had left on his socks to carry out the task.
Officers visited the men at the fountain, but found one man was covering his modesty with a pair of flesh coloured boxer shorts.
The men were advised by police about their actions and they then left the area.
City centre police tweeted: “Odd 999 10am; 3 men stripped naked & washing clothes in water feature Cathedral Gardens. 3 men from overseas advised and sent on their way.”

999 just because someone's naked? WTF??

I see they were from "overseas" - perhaps they were Dutch (see "encounters" thread)?

peter

Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: reubenT on July 21, 2015, 04:45:30 AM
Maybe they were homeless and figured that was a good place to wash up. 
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: milfmog on July 21, 2015, 09:27:25 AM
One day the police may learn to ask "What are the naked people doing?" and then point out that if what they are doing would be legal clothed then it is legal naked. It would help them to manage their budgets if they stopped responding to everything with no advance thought.

Well, I can hope.

Have fun,


Ian.
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on July 21, 2015, 07:54:18 PM
What does, "call 999" mean?

Here, I have seen the homeless, in the mornings, standing in the spray from lawn sprinklers. I've not seen any of them naked, but wearing as little as possible. They would stand and wash off as though they were in a shower stall. Rinsing clothes was also taken care of.

In the summer, it can be a relief and an invigorating way to start the day.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nudeytony on July 21, 2015, 09:46:40 PM
999 is the number to call in the UK in an emergency for police, fire, ambulance or coastguard. This would seem to be inappropriate in this case for 3 naked men doing nothing harmful or about to do something nasty. The security guard should have known better, he was probably bored on a quiet Sunday morning.

Tony
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on July 21, 2015, 10:07:55 PM
One day the police may learn to ask "What are the naked people doing?" and then point out that if what they are doing would be legal clothed then it is legal naked. It would help them to manage their budgets if they stopped responding to everything with no advance thought.

Well, I can hope.

Have fun,


Ian.
But then they wouldn't have the fun of seeing naked people. Would you rather respond to a call about a harmless naked person, or a real crime? ::)
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on July 21, 2015, 10:13:02 PM
What does, "call 999" mean?

Here, I have seen the homeless, in the mornings, standing in the spray from lawn sprinklers. I've not seen any of them naked, but wearing as little as possible. They would stand and wash off as though they were in a shower stall. Rinsing clothes was also taken care of.

In the summer, it can be a relief and an invigorating way to start the day.

Duane
I worked a few years in a detox/rehab. There are many homeless who would smell better in the summer if they washed in sprinklers. It is difficult to bath and wash on the street. In Vegas it is very hot and any place cool cost money, or they would not be invited.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on July 23, 2015, 06:11:20 PM
Quote from: Jbee
There are many homeless who would smell better in the summer if they washed in sprinklers. It is difficult to bathe and wash on the street. In Vegas it is very hot and any place cool cost money, or they would not be invited.

I've been in soups kitchens and can tell you that even in the homeless community, there is stratification. It happens everywhere. Seizing an opportunity to clean up is a personal choice. I've seen folks you would never guess were homeless. They look like an average person out on errands. Others you can tell from any distance and lighting.

In this part of the west it's getting harder to find places that still have grass and need to run sprinklers for upkeep. Desertification is a major part of the Water Board's policies. Low maintenance and low water usage is becoming the norm here. It's the way it needs to be.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on July 23, 2015, 06:30:25 PM
From the Manchester Evening News:
Police were called to reports of three men stripped completely NAKED washing their clothes in a city centre fountain.


Seems to me that when Romans invented and installed city centre fountains, the main purpose was to provide water and washing for the people of the city.  Apparently the people and police of Manchester have no concept of the purpose of their own public works. 
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on July 23, 2015, 06:38:37 PM
The Romans also had public baths, in cities affluent enough. There was little worry about gender mixing in a bath.

Much has been lost to history and memory.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Davie on July 27, 2015, 01:19:14 PM
Some of you will recognise the below quote from a thread on the BN website. Relating to the Police contol; room operators need to have a re-think on how they respond to reports of nudity. Should their response be:

"Was there anything beyond simple nudity, for example sexual or threatening behaviour?" "No". "Then It was probably just a naturist, and Naturism is not illegal, so nothing to worry about."
 or
"How terrible, you must have been traumatised, we will be there immediately, scramble the helicopter, expect a fleet of police cars. Have some tea and sympathy whilst we take your statement regarding these terrible events."

We know the answer don't we!

Davie  8)
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nudewalker on July 27, 2015, 04:34:54 PM
The Romans also had public baths, in cities affluent enough. There was little worry about gender mixing in a bath.

Much has been lost to history and memory.

Duane

Yes, much has been lost to history not only the Roman baths but a lot of the Greek culture pertaining to nudity also. Most Christian scholars portray the behavior as decadent or sinful.

Some of you will recognise the below quote from a thread on the BN website. Relating to the Police contol; room operators need to have a re-think on how they respond to reports of nudity. Should their response be:

"Was there anything beyond simple nudity, for example sexual or threatening behaviour?" "No". "Then It was probably just a naturist, and Naturism is not illegal, so nothing to worry about."
 or
"How terrible, you must have been traumatised, we will be there immediately, scramble the helicopter, expect a fleet of police cars. Have some tea and sympathy whilst we take your statement regarding these terrible events."

We know the answer don't we!

Davie  8)

I must admit that there have been no incidents that have warranted a SWAT team response for nudity that I am aware of however two instances come to mind. One related to a gentleman reading in his front window and a mother called the police. It seems they passed him daily on the way to the bus stop but on investigation there was no way the man could have exposed himself to the children without standing on a chair. The other one was a neighborhood dispute where one woman flashed the other family, children included. She was cited for lewd behavior and public indecency because of the children. I'm not ready to push the envelope yet but I have never heard a police call on the scanner for simple nudity.
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on July 27, 2015, 06:11:31 PM
I attended an informative lecture by Bob Morten, a head of the NAC this weekend. His anecdotal story was one of a man hiking in the forest up the hill from Los Angeles. He was arrested for hiking nude by a helicopter and 26 police officers. He had the book thrown at him. The result, with the help of NAC and the tenacity of the guy, was that all charges were dropped and an apologetic hand slap of an edict that declared policy in that area was issued. It wasn't, isn't and won't be illegal to hike nude in that government run forest. 

It happens. There are crazy police actions. There are a lot of some kind of dumb enthusiastic cops with peculiar attitudes about their positions. Lately, every week, there are guys like this are being exposed murdering, beating, abusing and torturing people. There are cops who want to be a hero, stepping out of their boundaries on a daily basis. If they don't have a law, sometimes they will apply another and abuse the system and the constitution that they are a sworn to uphold. We can't know which that we will get.

There needs to be a clarified policy in each department, an education given on nude activity and law. Perhaps each of us needs to get together with two other naturists, form an organization with a title and head down to the local chief of police with facts and get these policies and education to the cop on the street. When naturist work together with authorities, with a face, and perceived as a group, which we are, often things change. This may be better than hiding from uniformed mental cases and misconceptions...and we vote.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on July 28, 2015, 05:21:41 AM
You would think with all the real crazies running around they would be concentrating on finding people that represent a genuine threat. Maybe the odds on actually gettng a real conviction are higher with this kind of low hanging fruit. Or maybe it represents the best they can do.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nuduke on July 29, 2015, 09:45:25 PM
I am sure that enforcement officers of all sorts fall comfortably into their authority role as soon as they get to work. Many of you will be familiar with the research of Stanley Milgrom which typified how people comply when commanded by trusted authority to act in a certain way that may not accord with common sense and/or lacks ethical regard for other people.

John
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on July 29, 2015, 11:27:04 PM
Good point Nuduke. To me, that is all the more reason to set up guidelines and policy at a local level. It feels kinda scarey.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nuduke on July 30, 2015, 01:39:57 AM
Quite so!
J
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on July 30, 2015, 09:52:29 PM
The Romans also had public baths, in cities affluent enough. There was little worry about gender mixing in a bath.
Much has been lost to history and memory.
Duane


Indeed much has been lost.  Roman facilities were called "baths" but in daily life they were public toilets as much or more than baths, and were a necessary convenience in cities.  Toilet facilities were often arranged as semi-circle benches with waste openings every few feet.  Running water underneath carried off waste and clean running watter allowed use of wet sponges on sticks for washing.  Little or no concern was made for mixing of men and  women, nor for privacy during body functions.  Rich and poor would sit and discuss politics, business, or the weather while doing their bodily business.    The rest of the Roman baths were places of pleasures and few cared when someone was being sexual in public.  It just wasn't an issue. 

In today's culture dominated by anti-body asceticism any suggestion of sexuality is scorned by nudists who usually demand that bodies are acceptable only if they aren't doing any body functions.  In part that's driven by a surrounding culture that is very intolerant of normal human sexuality and hides all human waste elimination as "obscene" or "indecent."  Part of it is driven by the surrounding culture, but many nudists are part of that culture too. 

The more I learn about Imperial Roman culture the more I am convinced that they had it together pretty much.  We have lost so much.
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on July 31, 2015, 04:31:10 AM
I remember touring Pompeii. The streets were deep waste dumps. There were places to step over it and cross that had slots for carts. It was not all so perfect for a nose. There was a prostitute section, the only crooked road in the whole town, slaves. Not my ideal, but yep, we have lost a great deal, give time time, it's natural and so should come back to us. This anti-...body/sex/humanity BS hasn't been around that long.

Last year at the Rainbow Gathering the "shitters" had a cloth structure around them. People would wait politely. As things got more comfortable and those units filled up requiring more trenches, things changed amongst the tribe. Privacy disappeared. It took me getting used to. For me, roaming around completely nude was comfortable, but when I was joined by a young lady squatting and smiling at a trench looking for conversation while we defecated...well, that was new. I suppose that I would have adapted with a couple of more days, but we left.

I found our newbie naturist with the door open sitting on the toilet of the mobile home out at Ragged Top. I backed off, but she invited me in, assuring me that, "Its okay, We all have one and we all do it." Not a general custom amongst naturist or nudist. In close quarters...? I didn't know to draw a line or flow with hers.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: reubenT on July 31, 2015, 04:37:34 AM
our minds are so heavily affected by the cultural customs and thought patterns,  when we do manage to make a break from it,  we often only go halfway.     But it's a good start. 
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on July 31, 2015, 07:26:29 PM
A strange situation Jbee. Probably one I would also have found awkward.

As Reuben observed, it's a cultural custom that is seldom breached. Actually there would be nothing wrong with it, it just isn't done because of tradition. It's odd, not only among same sexes, but across the gender divide would be doubly strange.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nuduke on August 02, 2015, 09:33:26 PM
I bet our western cultural customs and habits arose as a combination of medieval religious prohibitions and then Victorian prurience.  Must look that up sometime.  Not that I'm particularly keen on having a dump alongside Jbee over a hole but the point I'm making is that our exclusively private toilet habits were invented in relatively recent times in the West and go along with the prohibitions and prejudices around nakedness.  Certainly our universal western habit of sitting whilst defecating is a recent invention and one that has deleterious effects.  I can tell you (a little disclosure here) that the more natural squatting posture for the voiding of bodily waste can have a tremendously beneficial effect on those suffering from haemorrhoids. 

I don't suffer from them (now!)

John
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: JOhnGw on August 02, 2015, 10:25:33 PM
Too much useful information.

I agree with you about the French "hole in floor" toilets though.
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on August 02, 2015, 11:40:50 PM
I have seen advertising for portable foot rests that raise your feet and legs upward to create a "squat" posture while using common western plumbing.   It also allows weight to rest on your backside and doesn't force knees to carry your weight.  I'm thinking of buying one. 

Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on August 03, 2015, 07:03:54 PM
... but the point I'm making is that our exclusively private toilet habits were invented in relatively recent times in the West and go along with the prohibitions and prejudices around nakedness.  Certainly our universal western habit of sitting whilst defecating is a recent invention and one that has deleterious effects.  I can tell you (a little disclosure here) that the more natural squatting posture for the voiding of bodily waste can have a tremendously beneficial effect on those suffering from haemorrhoids. 

I don't suffer from them (now!)

John

AH... NUDUKE! I have a very powerful imagination...OMG! TMI, TMI, TMI...

It is a fact that a pair of pants, most clothing will get in the way when squatting in the woods. The more natural way is most effective. No details here, but any one experience or experiment will attest to this. Clothing can be extremely unpractical and free bodies should not be outlawed.

Now, that unorthodox toilet is a practical effective notion, Bob. Not being used to the process as a norm, when in the woods, I have at times found portions of my legs getting worn and weak while maintaining that pose. Getting back up also has been a long, sometimes precarious, climb to full stature. This is because of a lack of adequate practice. It is not just custom that third world peoples squat, instead of using chairs. It is great for the back and practical. It is yoga. We are addicted to "civilized" chairs and stools. It would eliminate the need to carry a sittin' towel and make us more healthy in the long run, if we did squat.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nudewalker on August 04, 2015, 02:00:11 PM
... but the point I'm making is that our exclusively private toilet habits were invented in relatively recent times in the West and go along with the prohibitions and prejudices around nakedness.  Certainly our universal western habit of sitting whilst defecating is a recent invention and one that has deleterious effects.  I can tell you (a little disclosure here) that the more natural squatting posture for the voiding of bodily waste can have a tremendously beneficial effect on those suffering from haemorrhoids. 

I don't suffer from them (now!)

John

AH... NUDUKE! I have a very powerful imagination...OMG! TMI, TMI, TMI...

It is a fact that a pair of pants, most clothing will get in the way when squatting in the woods. The more natural way is most effective. No details here, but any one experience or experiment will attest to this. Clothing can be extremely unpractical and free bodies should not be outlawed.

Now, that unorthodox toilet is a practical effective notion, Bob. Not being used to the process as a norm, when in the woods, I have at times found portions of my legs getting worn and weak while maintaining that pose. Getting back up also has been a long, sometimes precarious, climb to full stature. This is because of a lack of adequate practice. It is not just custom that third world peoples squat, instead of using chairs. It is great for the back and practical. It is yoga. We are addicted to "civilized" chairs and stools. It would eliminate the need to carry a sittin' towel and make us more healthy in the long run, if we did squat.
Jbee

And then there are those stories from deer camp! The tradition here is that a group of guys will head to the woods for an extended period of time to hunt. Besides the copious amounts of beer that is drunk (which become stories in themselves) some poor soul will always have the unfortunate accident of not clearing his one piece coverall when doing his business in the woods. Then to add to the story; dressed in layers to protect from the cold they usually put the coveralls on again not realizing what's sitting on them. I remember one guy saying on return to camp "I stepped in it somewhere but can't find it on my boots!".
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on August 05, 2015, 07:07:25 PM
This conversation is spinning around the edge of the drain!
Sorry, couldn't resist that one.

I have learned the hard way that if you aren't already undressed, it is best to be so when attempting this action. There are too many ways to end up with a problem. Stripping off from the waist down is the 2nd best solution.

Duane
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on March 30, 2017, 03:18:52 AM
Just a thought, that DF and I have been bathing with other people nearly weekly for several years. The sweat/sauna is bathing. When we get in a swimming pool, we are bathing. When we skinnydip in a pond or creek, or a Redington Pass, we are bathing publicly with others.

These aren't so weird, so why should these guys be different? Someone can see them, which are people who wouldn't want to be seen nude, or bathe with others nude. Bathing with others has been acceptable forever. Why isn't it okay with just a few more others around? Jus' don't make sense....
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on March 30, 2017, 02:51:23 PM
These aren't so weird, so why should these guys be different? Someone can see them, which are people who wouldn't want to be seen nude, or bathe with others nude. Bathing with others has been acceptable forever. Why isn't it okay with just a few more others around? Jus' don't make sense....
Jbee 

You are right.  Clothes don't make sense most of the time.   Body shame is a form of public psychosis. 

I have learned the hard way that if you aren't already undressed, it is best to be so when attempting this action. There are too many ways to end up with a problem. Stripping off from the waist down is the 2nd best solution.
Duane


Over the past few years I find myself stripping my pants off entirely, and often my shirt as well, when taking a dump.  If I happen to be at a public facility with stalls, my pants get hung on a hook or wherever they can be placed.   Since I started living barefoot it has become a lot easier to remove pants entirely.  No bulky shoes to remove first. 

Naked is far better for body functions as well as for everything else. 

Bob
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nuduke on March 30, 2017, 11:58:15 PM

Yeah!  Nowadays I can't abide all that bunching your trousers and shorts round your ankles, I just take 'em off.  As Bob alluded to below I use a squat position aid at home - it's goes by the revolting name of a squatty potty (http://www.squattypotty.co.uk/) and I tell you it is worth its weight in fertiliser!  When I discovered the benefits of squatting many years ago, I used to squat perched on the seat.  You need to take your trousers off for that. The effect was brilliant though - no more piles and I never looked back...er..so to speak.
When I discovered the - sorry -squatty potty, I was amazed!  The thing puts you in a slightly different (and more efficacious) position than squatting on the seat and the improvement to swift, clean and comfortable evacuation was well worth the ridiculous price of £20 or so for what is essentially a simple plastic moulding.  When I first started to use it my boluses emerged like the Flying Scotsman in full steam from the Welwyn Tunnel, but not green! 
I recommend it. 
John
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on March 31, 2017, 01:51:32 AM
Nuduke, there is nothing in the advertising that promises "green." If that is your intent, I can testify that eating plenty of green veggies will produce that desired result.  ::)

I did notice that they are marketing a new wooden edition, while I took your link to watch the prince and unicorn advert, yet once again. I've always enjoyed the rustic look.
 
I appreciate the contraption daily and when caught out and about in need, I miss it dearly.
Jbee
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on March 31, 2017, 02:52:52 AM
Yeah!  Nowadays I can't abide all that bunching your trousers and shorts round your ankles, I just take 'em off.

At home or away I take my pants off.   Pants pulled down keep one's feet, knees, and legs together which doesn't work for me.


Quote
As Bob alluded to below I use a squat position aid at home - it's goes by the revolting name of a squatty potty (http://www.squattypotty.co.uk/) and I tell you it is worth its weight in fertiliser! 

I looked at the Squattypotty.  Then I noticed that we have a white plastic thing intended to be a step up for short people to reach high shelves or something.  Its just about the right height and width for a raised foot rest.  I guess I'm too cheap to buy the specialty made item.


Quote
When I discovered the - sorry -squatty potty, I was amazed!  The thing puts you in a slightly different (and more efficacious) position than squatting on the seat and the improvement to swift, clean and comfortable evacuation was well worth the ridiculous price of £20 or so for what is essentially a simple plastic moulding. 

Its probably worth the price, but i think my kitchen step was about 1/4 that much.  I'm glad they are promoting proper positions but I'm cheap. 


Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: Bob Knows on March 31, 2017, 02:55:14 AM
I did notice that they are marketing a new wooden edition, while I took your link to watch the prince and unicorn advert, yet once again. I've always enjoyed the rustic look.
Jbee

A bit of an old log would do the same function and be rustic.  I'm going with a cheap plastic step stool. 
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: eyesup on March 31, 2017, 08:10:24 AM
Most western European cultures have moved away from group bathing. Some of the northern Europeans still practice, but it seems to be disappearing.

When you answer natures call, just go naturally. If someone comes by, you are already in a vulnerable position. Why worry if you are completley naked? In an attempt to reduce an awkward situation I once made a deposit in the very place I was trying to avoid in the 1st place. Hence I now always strip down completely. Problem solved.

Duane

Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: JOhnGw on March 31, 2017, 10:30:38 AM
Nuduke, there is nothing in the advertising that promises "green."

Jbee
I think the word green referred to the colour of the Flying Scotsman locomotive emerging from the Welwyn tunnel.
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: nuduke on April 07, 2017, 09:10:09 PM


Quite so, I meant : Flying Scotsman = green, Dung = brown...well advised JOhn! :)
I guess our transatlantic friends would not readily click on to that icon of every 1950s/60s schoolboy's life!
John
Title: Re: Cleanliness is next to free range-ness
Post by: jbeegoode on April 07, 2017, 10:47:55 PM
Don't have a reference to a Flying Scottsman, but caught on that the steam wasn't about emerging on a cold day. I was just joking around.
Jbee