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Free Range Naturism / Re: Solstice hike, Vermont June 21
« on: Today at 12:29:59 AM »

Some of my best nudist moments were on a few precious days when I got up before dawn before what would become a fine cloudless sunny day and went to the woods or stayed in the garden and spent naked time in twilight and welcomed the dawn with my nakedness.  There have only been a relatively few of these occasions, though.  Nowadays, I have theoretically plenty of occasions to experience dawn whilst skyclad but somehow, I can't be arsed to get up and drive out to a suitable hike. Don't know why I am less motivated to do that now that it's easier.  I must be perversely contrary!


We have books. We have books, everywhere. Every room in the house has books except the laundry and bath rooms. I donít understand why people donít like books.

We used to have rooms full of books and decided to slim down our 'library' when we moved house in 2015.  Mrs N and I reflected why we both considered the collecting of books to be such a desirable object.  It dawned upon me that the accumulation of books is a middle class affectation that suggests you are 'well read' i.e. the number of books is in direct proportion to how intelligent and knowledgeable you are!  People with books are the people to know, perhaps.  We liked the message that we were a bit academic.
Mrs N had to agree that for us this was probably true and we both reacted against the shallowness of that.
This realisation spurred us on to more ruthless editing of the book collection.  Nevertheless it was surprising how many books did mean something more to us than just the information or entertainment they contained or their 'lifestyle' value.  So many books carried a connection to some part of life or an assortment of memories.  I kept a couple of children's books that my kids had enjoyed me reading to them.  Those books had happy times with the kids adsorbed into the pages and reminded me of it very strongly.  I kept my text books from my A Level metalwork because that was a nice time in my life and I loved doing the metalwork.  No harm in a few books after all provided you are not keeping them for appearances alone.  We chucked out or gave away about 2/3 of the books and felt cleansed and happier without them.  Our collection continues once again to increase, however!

General Naturism Discussion / Re: Smooth Hound
« on: June 24, 2018, 11:52:47 PM »

Quote from: JBee
Yea, I couldn't imagine hassling with shaving the rest of me everyday.
In fact, it only takes me a minute or two a day, when it's 'bald', to keep smooth.

It's interesting how the majority of opinion seems to be against shaving the pubic region or rest of body yet trimming of head hair and shaving the face is normal. I'm not suggesting hypocrisy here, just that we all have deeply embedded norms to deal with that makes us think a lack of natural hair in one place (pubes) is unnatural but that routinely shaving another place (face) simply goes alongside as totally normal.  I am equally dualistic - I make myself smooth from the neck down yet I have quite long head hair and a goatee beard which I keep very closely clipped.  Not consistent and subject to hegemony!
Have we now come to the conclusion that to be truly naturist naked then, you shouldn't cut any hair at all?  In Sikhism, hair is allowed to grow naturally as respect for the perfection of God's creation. That's very akin to what several of you have said about accepting what we are and what body and features we are given. 
Mind you, amongst Muslims, hair removal is part of achieving general purity and cleanliness and includes the trimming of nails and the removing of armpit and pubic hair.
I don't know about any of this obligatory stuff though.  In my case I find it aesthetically pleasing, hygienic and a matter of choice not obligation or spiritual belief. 


Trip reports / Re: Whetstone Weekend: Part III Oaks in the Forest
« on: June 11, 2018, 11:48:12 PM »

Pardon me for angling off on a dogleg but Bob wrote:
Roman dining rooms typically had 3 couches on 3 sides of their table.  The 4th side was for the server.   It was called the "triclinium," which means 3 couch room[/q]

I've known that word since I did Latin at school in the 60s and helped my son learn it too when he did Latin at school and never known the derivation.  I was delighted to acquire that fact. They say you learn something new every day and that was today's crop (actually the second thing I learned!). Thank you so much for that, Bob - you've made an old man very happy! :D

Free Range Naturism / Re: Being seen while getting mail.
« on: June 11, 2018, 11:38:40 PM »

I have to say how uplifted I am to find that even you, Bob, who is so forthright about your naturism and seemingly so comfortable with it has some similar issues with your wife as myself (although I think, in lesser degree).  Up to this set of posts I had gotten the impression that your wife was fully tolerant and accepting of your lifestyle and was privy to all your FRN activity.  I felt rather isolated with my wife having such strong anti naturist views but it seems that Ric and yourself do have some degree of disapproval to contend with.  I feel my conjugal relationship re naturism is a bit more normal now!   
Might I ask, Bob, if you do have to practice some 'non disclosure' as you mention, does your wife know about your didactic 'Greenbare' website where you celebrate with huge enthusiasm and aplomb the natural naked body and your point of view that everything about it is natural and to be celebrated. Is she aware of FRN?

General Naturism Discussion / Re: Smooth Hound
« on: June 11, 2018, 11:21:59 PM »

Some interesting views here.  I guessed most of you were going to be 'naturalists' even if it's for reasons of can't be bothered to adapt the natural 'landscape'.
I make no apology for my preference although this prompted thought

That's what other people say about naked men, isn't it?

Most nudists say nudism is about "body acceptance."    That is the antithesis of rejecting your own natural body.

Is my preference for being smooth a rejection of body acceptance?  I guess it must be, in a way, although I definitely don't think of removing my hair as improving on something I believe is wrong or needs rejecting.  I just find it a nicer feeling and more practical about the nether regions and I like the way I look smooth but I don't hate myself with body hair.  The good thing about body hair is that whatever you care to do is usually reversible!  One day I might let the groin sprout again. 

Tattoos are not in practice reversible and I definitely don't like tattoos.  I can't understand why people want to adopt such a permanent decoration.  Not only that, they sometimes look like clothes!  Tats are often badly drawn or are an image that goes out of fashion.  It must be awful if you get a bad one done and are faced with putting up with it for the rest of your life.  I don't oppose anyone's right to have tattoos and I am sufficiently imbued with body acceptance that I would not devalue someone with tats.  In fact I learned with some surprise that one of the people I respected and learned such a lot from in working days had tattoos.  Someone you just wouldn't think would have one had a huge design over one upper arm shoulder and halfway down the back (he showed it to a group of colleagues once).  It did not shift my esteem one jot other than to make me wonder why such an intelligent, thoughtful and clever person would not have thought twice before such a radical step.  He was someone who had a rock solid justification for everything and a solid logic underpinning all his doings.  I never managed to ask him what the reason was! Why someone hasn't invented a semi permanent equivalent, I don't know.  We used to get skin transfers as kids - they lasted a couple of days, you would think in these days of fake tans, enhanced breasts and lips pumped up with silicone that someone would have come up with a cosmetic tattoo that could be applied to any design, lasts 6 months and then taken off with a solvent or something.  I guess anything applied to the skin will slough off with the natural shedding of dead skin cells but a tat dyes the skin itself.

I feel much the same about piercings.  The only thing I ever totally forbad either of my sons to do was have a piercing when one of them declared they wanted to  (happily neither wanted tats).  He thanked me a few years later for stopping him as he realised he didn't really want a permanent modification himself that badly - it was mainly peer pressure and by then he had woken up to the fact that a lot of people have prejudices about piercings particularly prospective employers and partners! 


General Naturism Discussion / Re: Smooth Hound
« on: June 10, 2018, 09:13:20 PM »
Body hair is there to serve some evolutionary purpose.  Hair is both beautiful and functional.   I don't enjoy seeing the ugliness of those who shave off all their beautiful hair on any part of their body.  It also looks perverted in some fundamental way.  Of course, you have freedom to be as ugly and unnatural as you want, but don't expect me to enjoy seeing it.

As you have illustrated, Bob, opinion is divided as to what is most appropriate/desirable/attractive.  I would agree that being a smoothie is a perversion in some respects as it does go against nature and is something that has to be maintained against the natural propensities of one's body (for hair to grow).  However, amongst perversions, it's a fairly benign one I hope you will agree.  As you have opined many times in the context of prosecutions and news articles supporting the position of naked people that have fallen foul of the law or others' idea of hegemonic social norms, even if I were to expect you to enjoy seeing it you have the option simply not to look rather than restrict or prevent my right to do it (always provided it harms no one)! 

Trip reports / Re: Whetstone Weekend: Part III Oaks in the Forest
« on: June 10, 2018, 09:02:53 PM »

I've added some comments in your original post, Blue Train

I imagine, though, that the first object is to have a life worth living.
Now that's a very profound and appropriate addition to my list!

However, I'm retired now and I don't miss work.
I was writing from the point of view of one who has also retired.  I don't miss work either but you are right, work does create essential social contact.  I do several work-like activities in retirement e.g. serve on local government.

Cats, for example, can be wonderful companions but you still have to clean the litter box.
I don't have pets because of the ties, responsibility, cost and chores they generate.  Cuddly and friendly though they may be that doesn't, for me, override the shackles and obligations of pet ownership

I also agree that physical activity is a Good Thing but I believe that doing some manual work, physical work with your hands, is even better,
Entirely agreed - that falls into my definition of exercise!

I am not so sure about social contacts, though. But my perspective is probably skewed. I actually study books about solitaries. That is, religious solitaries, and also hermits (hermits are not solitaries in the same sense).
I can't help bumping in to articles and other media about research that says that in older age our prior and current social activity makes a huge difference to mental health and the incidence of dementia. It doesn't mean there aren't exceptions or degrees of need.  Some people, as you say, may prefer being solitary and benefit from that more. 

But people who keep to themselves are looked upon with suspicion just about everywhere.
This is a great shame and is another example of man's inhumanity to man

So are nudists.
Too right - see above!

You must always be a good neighbor yourself, too, without qualification.
Also a general tenet for all and a basis of several religions (if not all!)

We do have our books here at home. I hope none of the shelves collapse and bury us. I visited my hometown a couple of weeks ago and saw all my remaining relatives while I was there. None had any books in sight
I think you are at an advantage - it is possible to have  all three - books, TV and sofa :)

I am curious as to where you live, Blue Train.  I'm assuming in the USA somewhere.  Is this something you would like to reveal?

Free Range Naturism / Re: Legal clarification
« on: June 10, 2018, 03:58:19 PM »
What a brilliant notice, Davie!
You have to applaud the Scotland Forest people for open mindedness and emancipation.
Good for them.  Perhaps someone should ask them to replace the notice with a permanent one and stick one up everywhere and advertise their action to the Forestry commission in England & Wales!

General Naturism Discussion / Smooth Hound
« on: June 10, 2018, 03:54:18 PM »

I just wanted to share this to find out what others do.

Over the years I have become a smooth naturist i.e. I remove all hair below the neck if I can.
Whilst I used to leave a bit of pube up to a year or so ago (wife's protestations again), I now remove all my body hair and I have to say that I love my appearance 'smooth' i.e. without any unseemly tufts of hair everywhere.  One aid to keeping myself smooth has been a Philips Bodygroom which was recommended by Nigel Nib who is (or was) also a smoothie (not to be confused with the beverage of pulverised fruit - non, no it would be very uncomfortable to have your fruits pulverised!).  I also have a shave in the shower each day which keeps everything as hairless as is practical.
What do you do, dear Free Range Naturists?  Hairy, semi shaved or smooth?  Have we discussed this before? - I don't recall if we have.
My journey to hairlessness has been one of many years.  It started with practicality.  I used to suffer from haemorrhoids which I have cured over the years by better diet and squatting to defaecate.  However I was troubled by this perianal nuisance for many years and had to put gooey ointments on them to stave the pain.  However, this was a very messy arrangement as I had hair around my anus and in my crack and this used to get caked with the cream and cause skid marks on the underpants etc.  The better pile relief preparations are oil or petroleum jelly based making it a sticky and messy perpetual chore to get the ointment on or off.  Sorry - is this too much information?  So one day I decided to trim  the perianal hair which I did by crouching over a mirror.  This led to a great improvement in dealing with the pile ointment until eventually I shaved the hair off altogether between my buttocks and across my perineum.  Not only did this improve the pile ointment problem enormously but it led to a considerable improvement in hygiene after defaecation and felt nice too!  Then one day I thought I might do under my arms.  Been doing that so long now the hair in those regions never really grows back significantly and I only need to shave them once every few weeks. 

I am not very hairy overall - never had any hair on my calves and lower leg and very little on my upper legs and only a central 'tuft' on my chest (which I never liked).  But for probably social cohesive reasons etc., I didn't want to be seen in the changing room or bedroom without pubes - it was more years before my attention turned to the pubic, femoral and torso regions!  Eventually, having discovered Nib's secret the Philips Body groomer, I started to shave any remaining hair from my legs and chest and a 'Number One' cut on my pubes (i.e. the shortest length with the clippers).  And over time and particularly in recent months I have cast away my wife's preference for me having pubes (she says I look like a baby without!) and I now shave everything I can find regularly and the pubes daily to be as smooth a smoothie as I can and I have to say I find not having any body hair a perpetual pleasure in appearance and convenience.

I do have long hair on my head (I can just about gather it in a small pony tail at the back) and a gohti beard (clipped to number 1) so I feel a bit of a hypocrite re smoothness.  However, I'm told I look a trifle more wise and distinguť with the beard (particularly by Mrs N) and I am somewhat afraid of the radicalness and possible regrowth consequences (all grey?) if I have a clippered haircut or a shaved head.  That aspect of smoothness about the head to match the body bothers me hardly at all although I am slightly envious of the many males of my acquaintance who have shaved heads - less bother with hairdressers, shampooing and time saved in the morning brushing it.  But perhaps more bother with shaving preparations and razors in the shower.  Can one shave one's own head without craning in the mirror and risking lacerations from the razor? I have to admit that if I'm not careful I can get a blaze of barber's rash (I get this on face from wet shaving so I always use an electric although, for no reason apparent, the electric tends to irritate my groin regions whilst being better for the face).

Enough from me!!
Any comments?
Smoothie John

General Naturism Discussion / Re: What do you say if they say....?
« on: June 10, 2018, 03:06:34 PM »

You need sunblock, ask any doctor. Doctors know.
I recently was asked to consult my doctor after a blood test returned a very low VitD count.  She gave me supplements for 7 weeks which returned me to normal levels and at the consultation for that we talked about getting sunshine.  She recommended being in the sun and revealing as much as possible - at least torso and arms, she opined, little knowing that I was delighted to get a mandate to expose all to the solar rays.  She also said I should not wear sunblock as it absorbed the UVB.  However, she also advocated being sensible and sunbathing for only about half an hour at a time.
Thank you, Doc!  Mandate for naturism for health!

Free Range Naturism / Re: Legal clarification
« on: June 10, 2018, 03:00:07 PM »

Well, Bob
This document seems a great template for someone to get AANR campaigning for federal adoption to make nudity legal across all US states!
I would be surprised if AANR didn't keep an eye on BNs activities - they may already be mobilising the campaign...or do I overestimate AANR?

I note that the nudity police guide is applicable in England and Wales only.  There is some way to go to get it UK-wide too.
Hopefully Scotland is there already.  Northern Ireland is sometimes a bit shy of addressing such issues if the recent abortion legislation controversy is anything to go by. (NI still retains illegality of abortion where the rest of the UK emancipated itself from its prior constraints many years ago).

Trip reports / Re: Whetstone Weekend: Part III Oaks in the Forest
« on: June 10, 2018, 02:25:15 PM »

The more I read about the secrets of longevity the simpler it becomes.
What I mean by longevity is not about prolonging life span (heaven forbid!) but what I do seek is to help me in whatever span is left to me, to be mobile, compos mentis, socially active and able to enjoy life independent of support from others and with as little medical assistance as possible.

There are no secrets to it.  In no particular order the good things to do in retirement seem to be
No 1 is to exercise and be aware of maintaining balance and suppleness (I do yoga and a few other not very systematic bits of walking and working).
No 2 is to eat a balanced diet with plenty of veg and fish and lean on fats and carbohydrates.
No 3 is to keep your brain active with intellectual activity (not high brow necessarily - a crossword or a good thriller will do!), challenge your psyche with new experiences and pastimes, volunteering etc.
No 4 is to maintain social contacts, involvement and family relationships - definitely do not become isolated.
No 5 is to be naked as much as is practical!

I don't think there are any potions, lotions, lifestyles or gadgets that can do any better than that lot!
What do we think?  Agree?  Disagree?  Have I left out anything obvious?

Free Range Naturism / Re: Being seen while getting mail.
« on: June 10, 2018, 02:02:26 PM »

Well, I am much gratified to find that Ric, who is a much bolder and vastly more experienced naturist than I, experiences some of the same paranoia about being 'discovered by a stranger' from his wife as I do from my Mrs N.  It is also a new finding that your full exploits, as documented on these hallowed pages, has been the subject of partial "non disclosure'' (good way of putting it!) to your wife, Ric.  Obviously I have such unmentioned areas of my naturism and always feel a bit guilty about that.  It's always nice to know you're not the only one.  So thank you for that bit of disclosure, Ric, I feel better that I am somewhat less out on a limb for spousal disapproval than I thought.
As I have referred to several times in the past, my wife and I in younger years (mid 20s) had 2 or 3 naturist experiences on beaches at which time she appeared to be happy to be naked. But on occasions in recent years that these experiences have been recalled she claims not to have been happy about it.  By contrast Ric's wife does join in and is somewhat of a naturist today. But Mrs N did get naked and sunbathe on Greek and Moroccan beaches for hours at a time - was this an extreme manifestation of her parallel tendency to conform overriding her dislike of nudity? 

JBee, I would love your scenario to come to pass of being discovered by a caller to our house.  My wife's fears far outweigh the likely actual consequences of a naked encounter with a visitor.  I think that some of our friends (by no means all!!) would actually join in...or at least treat the event as unremarkable and be happy for me to stay nude.  A question arises as to what my reaction would be?  I am mature enough with my own command of naturism that I know I would not panic or grab my genitals and rush off bent double in embarrassment.  There would be no rushing off to hide.  However, would I stay naked - given that I am in my own home and therefore entirely within my rights to be dressed as I like?  My mind says that I would cover up.  To whoever might encounter me I would say "Do you want me to cover up a bit?" and if the response was in the affirmative I would saunter off and don a minimum of clothes e.g. a pair of shorts or a wrap. Maybe a T-shirt. I do this with my wife.  When she joins me and I have been naked I will throw something on in deference to her wishes which, regrettably, even though she has been more permissive lately, do seemingly run deep.

Whilst we are discussing people's reactions to one being naked, I was again saddened by my art class colleagues.  Someone asked me earlier this week how I was getting on in my life classes (next class in a couple of weeks!) and there ensued a short interchange of slightly giggling embarrassed humour.  The other guy in the class asked if I would like to be a life model for this class.  I somewhat chickened out and cheerily replied that I would be delighted to do that but it wouldn't be ideal because if I was modelling I'd miss the class myself!  Thank goodness there are some art students, i.e. my life class colleagues, who have a proper, mature attitude to the naked body.

Drawing the human form is one of the hardest things I have done for a very long time - getting your hand to reproduce what your eye sees and stopping the brain misinterpreting proportion and shape is phenomenally hard.  That's why I do it - it keeps the brain fresh.  I asked my wife if she would model for me.  She said yes.  She was settling down to watch a film in the living room so I suggested that she might model whilst she is watching the film.  "Oh no! She exclaimed.  "I'm sorry but I just couldn't sit and watch a film whilst naked - I just couldn't"  How irrational is that?  She then said "I don't mind coming up to your study and doing it but I just couldn't be naked in the living room in from to the telly."   So I have her agreement to model at least.  (She had also said she would on a previous occasion).  When she does, I will be clothed.  I think psychologically that would make her more comfortable.  I will give you the news if it happens!


Free Range Naturism / Re: Legal clarification
« on: June 06, 2018, 01:53:12 AM »

Excellent news.
Thank you for posting that, Davie.
This does seem to be a significant step forward not least that if apprehended whilst innocently practicing naturism one can wave that paper at the officer in attendance.  It's sort of a nudist license plate!

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