Whetstone Weekend: Part II Mysteries Solved?

[jbeegoode]

Aluminum melts at 1600F. They are the burner that you put the pot on I think. I've got one made from a Foster's Can.
It is ultra light. I used to melt down used military aircraft into ingots.
Jbee

[Greenbare Woods]

The point is, never leave home without soda cans and a penny. It would also have to be a very, very hot wood fire to melt an aluminum can.

I have a friend who likes to put an empty steel can into a fire, and then melt all the used aluminum soda and beer cans into a block by putting them into the steel can one at a time.  When the steel can is half full he pours the melted aluminum out into a small depression in sand or whatever is handy.  Use a pliers to hold the steel can. Then later he sells the aluminum to a recycle place.  It only takes an ordinary wood fire.

The Boy scout use of soda cans for cooking may have come from the 1950s when soda or beer cans were steel. 

Any Boy Scout knows you only cook on hot coals, anyway.

True.  When I was in Boy Scouts we put our pans directly on some coals that had been moved out of the flames, or perhaps on rocks.

Bob

 

[BlueTrain]

Just did a little test. My aluminum soda can didn't melt. It essentially combusted, the part over the flame.

I was using my 45 year-old Svea stove, which can heat like a blowtorch, the little part on the top that spreads the flame getting red hot. Within five minutes, the side of the can directly over the burner turned to what amounted to ash. I suppose you could melt it in a steel can but that wasn't what I was testing. But I also imagine you could easily boil water in a soda can with no problem, even without removing the top or anything. You'd have to watch what you were doing, just the same, because, you know, a watched pot will in fact boil. Besides, I don't know of anything thinner than a soda can except for foil, which is used in cooking all the time, including on campfires.

Probably the last think you'd try to be doing when cooking or in a "survival" situation would be trying to melt aluminum. And in my case, every single pot and pan in my accumulation of outdoor gear from my old Boy Scout cook kit on, is made of aluminum. And I even fixed breakfast this morning with an aluminum griddle.

I think there's a way to boil water in a birchbark container, provided you live where birch trees grow. It sounds like a lot of trouble, though.

[eyesup]

Whetstone Weekend: Part II Mysteries Solved?
Google soda, beverage or beer can stove and you will get all kinds of different versions of this. I believe it was 1st made by backpackers because of it’s weight. Just a few grams. I’ve seen websites that push this design as far as they can ( ).
See here, here, here, and here.

As with a real stove, the hottest part of the flame doesn’t actually touch the metal. It ignites and burns a couple millimeters away so the temperature drops off there. Besides it’s an alcohol fuel. The melting point of aluminum is 660°C or 1220°F. A propane flame burns at about 1900°C. Ethanol burns about 1200°C.

If this was a concern no acetylene torch would survive it’s 1st use.

Duane

[eyesup]

I saw Lee Stroud boil water in a plastic water bottle on Survivor Man.

The water carried away the heat so the plastic didn't melt.

Duane

[Greenbare Woods]

Just did a little test. My aluminum soda can didn't melt. It essentially combusted, the part over the flame.

Aluminum burns very hot.  The solid rockets that used to lift off the US Space Shuttle used aluminum as their primary fuel. 

I was using my 45 year-old Svea stove, which can heat like a blowtorch, the little part on the top that spreads the flame getting red hot. Within five minutes, the side of the can directly over the burner turned to what amounted to ash. I suppose you could melt it in a steel can but that wasn't what I was testing. But I also imagine you could easily boil water in a soda can with no problem, even without removing the top or anything. You'd have to watch what you were doing, just the same, because, you know, a watched pot will in fact boil. Besides, I don't know of anything thinner than a soda can except for foil, which is used in cooking all the time, including on campfires.

Probably the last think you'd try to be doing when cooking or in a "survival" situation would be trying to melt aluminum. And in my case, every single pot and pan in my accumulation of outdoor gear from my old Boy Scout cook kit on, is made of aluminum. And I even fixed breakfast this morning with an aluminum griddle.

I think there's a way to boil water in a birchbark container, provided you live where birch trees grow. It sounds like a lot of trouble, though.

Aluminum conducts heat very quickly.  Aluminum pans never get to melting temp because they conduct the heat away.  However, I have seen aluminum foil melt when used in a cooking situation. 

[eyesup]

Copper has a higher heat transfer rate than aluminum and a higher melting point.

I was doing some research on making my own chiller coil for when I make BEER. Steel is cheaper but hard to work with and doesn’t transfer heat as fast and it’s easy to take care of so it’s better to buy one. Copper is easy to work with if you want to make your own and has the highest heat transfer rate but it’s expensive and more work to take care of.

Decisions, decisions. All for the sake of the BEER!
Aluminum is generally not used in the higher end boil kettles. Stainless steel and/or copper are preferred.

Duane

[nuduke]

What was the penny for?
John

[jbeegoode]

Aluminum is supposed to be bad for cooking in as it has been discovered to leak metals or something. Time to google. So, my latest camping pot is titanium...I don't know, DF is serious about such stuff.
Jbee

[eyesup]

The penny, it could be a plug nickel but not everyone has a plug nickel, is to cover the filler hole in the center to help maintain pressure at the perimeter where the jet holes are.

You pour in the alcohol and then drop the penny over the filer hole. Leave a little alcohol residue and light’er up. The heat then forces the vapor out through the jet holes.

Voila, a burner!

Duane

[eyesup]

There were reports a few years ago that aluminum was linked to brain conditions that caused the onset of Alzheimer's disease. Don’t know if that panned out. I seem to remember that the alleged effects didn’t hold up later.

Duane

[BlueTrain]

Every now and then, there are reports of something dreadful resulting from everyday things that people have been using for generations, either to cook with, like aluminum or even cast iron, or something we eat (the list is endless) or where we live, especially the basements or near fault lines or rivers. But life goes on.