Author Topic: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law  (Read 6680 times)

Bob Knows

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Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« on: October 01, 2013, 05:21:07 PM »
Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law:

Despite having about 60 moral advocates who whined that seeing a body was "assault" on them, the City council defeated the proposal 4 to 2.  Wisdom won today.  But the anti-nude folks probably won't give up. 

This law was motivated by coffee baristas appearing in scanty outfits and having top free Tuesday.  Note that the law would have prohibited all nudist activity throughout the city. 

In general its probably good for nudists and naturists to have baristas working partly naked and having a public discussion about prohibiting nudity.  Nudity won.  We are back to the state law which allows nudity as long as there is no intent to cause alarm or confrontation with someone.  Coffee sellers are conducting lawful business and are legal.  So, it would seem, are other naked people.



ORDNANCE PROPOSED

LINK
SPOKANE, Wash. -- The Spokane City Council will discuss a proposed ordinance that would make unlawful public exposure a criminal misdemeanor on Monday night.

The ordinance is in response to the ongoing controversy surrounding nearly nude baristas according to Spokane leaders. People who are opposed to the nearly nude baristas argue that children and others who do not want to see their exposed bodies cannot avoid it.
 
"It probably wouldn't stop here, you know, if ordinances are being passed that quickly and easily. I don't see why it couldn't go any further than that," said Sarah Birnel, the owner of XXXtreme Expresso.
 
According to city documents, there is currently no separate charge in the Spokane Municipal Code for unlawful public exposure. The new, proposed ordinance would create a separate charge designated as unlawful public exposure, which would still be a criminal misdemeanor.

The ordinance also defines the boundaries of unlawful public exposure. The exact ordinance reads:
 
""Unlawful public exposure" means the exposure of any of the following body parts of the person without a full and opaque covering in other than a public place provided or set apart for nudity:
 1.Any part of the male or female genitals, pubic hair, pubic area, perineum, anus, or bottom one-half of the anal cleft;
2.Any part of the areola or nipple of the female breast;, or
3.More than one-half of the part of the female breast located below the top of the areola."
 
It does not apply to exposure for scientific, cultural, or educational purposes, expression that is protected by the federal or state constitution, children younger than ten, or an exposed female breast for nursing purposes.




ORDNANCE PROPOSAL DEFEATED

LINK
by JENICA VILLAMOR & KREM.com
KREM.com
Posted on October 1, 2013 at 12:22 AM
SPOKANE -- Spokane City Council decided Monday night to reject the idea of putting restrictions on barely nude baristas.  They voted 4 to 2 against the ordinance.
 
More than 60 people signed up to speak at city council.  Most of them who showed up were protesters.  When the decision was made on rejecting the ordinance, they were so upset they stormed out of the room.
 
The city council decided not pass the ordinance for two reasons: One, there is currently a lack of resources to enforce the ordinance.  The second reason is because they said it is hard to determine what is appropriate and what is not for everyone in the community.
 
The owner of the Triple X Espresso stands also spoke.  She said her business is not adult entertainment.  She said she was thrilled about the news and plans on taming the business down.  She said she will rename it Bare Beans.
 
City leaders said if the concerns of nearly nude baristas continue, they might revisit the issue down the road.
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stuart

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2013, 05:58:23 PM »
I do love these incredibly detailed descriptions of just how much of your body you can show or not show. Some people clearly give the subject far too much thought. "More than one-half of the part of the female breast located below the top of the areola" is one of the most anally retentive I've seen yet.

jbeegoode

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2013, 10:56:58 PM »
So if you shave your pubic hair and sit down naked with your legs closed it is legal, or stand with your hands covering the front of the genitals or a small hanging piece of fabric, AND you have a big enough buttock to cover what is between your legs, you can walk in the nude in public. Excepting women, whose breasts are more lewd than men's, but okay if part of them are covered with a strip of cloth of various size and color AND the woman is given free choice as to which part will be lewd, other than the colored body bits, no matter what the size...Nah, I'm not confused. The lawmaker is confused. Would a dab of body pain be okay? Let's see, if a woman has a small breast the coverage would be a dab of cloth. The larger woman would need cloth enough to cover the smaller woman's entire chest. If the breast sags, then the underside could be half, although it is not seen anyway, freeing the rest, but the nipple....what a laugh!

How do these people get elected?
Jbee
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reubenT

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2015, 08:55:54 AM »
I'm afraid that in spite of the advanced knowledge of our age,  we did not leave major stupidity behind with the superstitions of the dark ages.    Such thinking can be classed with believing the world is flat and that a pile of dirty rags spontaneously produces rats.    Common sense should tell us there's no difference between this spot of skin and that one,  but that it's all in the mind of the viewer whether this spot is immoral and that one is not.    One may say it is and another it's not.    Ask the South American natives and they'll tell ya non of it is immoral.   Ask a muslim and all of it is.   Ask the One who created us;    He says we were very good,  and that before we covered ourselves with anything.   That's the stand good Christians should take,  but alas,  we've been tricked into believing something entirely different.  Our minds have been programmed erroneously to look at nakedness and allow it to send our minds into sinful thought processes.     Being thrown into a roomful of naked people doing normal things and forced to stay there a few days would help cure the problem.   

eyesup

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2015, 07:58:29 PM »
There are scriptures to back up that statement, Reuben.

But instead I'll quote the Bard:
Why then 'tis none to you; for there is nothing either good or
bad, but thinking makes it so.
                                Hamlet Act 2, scene 2

It seems this is a historical affliction that is still rampant.

Duane

jbeegoode

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2015, 09:16:04 PM »
...Being thrown into a roomful of naked people doing normal things and forced to stay there a few days would help cure the problem.

Oh if only textile obsession were classified as a cult and we could do that. There are people who are extremely anxious about being seen and seeing skin. They have to be slowly conditioned in a behavior mod manner and talk therapy. To do such might give a heart attack and trauma.

 That's all it takes. A few days at a naturist resort with no clothing on hand, being accepted as nude and people get adjusted for life. It doesn't take long to discover that clothing is over valued, even weird.
Jbee
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Kayaker

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2015, 12:02:48 AM »
I think the root of the perplexity in Bob's bare baristas is... Back to sexuality and suggestiveness.  The moral or immorally intention to suggest... Well you know.  If it were just bare naked ladies of all shapes and sizes with coffee service it wouldn't be risqué at all.  I bet if you opened up a nude- only coffe bar it would succeed (sign on the door reads if shirt and shoes no service.). Hey Bob, that could be your business venture..

So, if the hint of nudity is tampering with the imagination and somehow that is risky and exciting (like Duanes thread on same topic) Then I kinda get the reason for some pushback.

I'm wondering, as a point of precedence, has Spokane ever hosted a car wash with scantily clad cheerleaders for a local charity or fund raiser?

If you subtract the element of sexuality from the casual presence of nudity its a game changer.  Just like the little kids mentioned in an earlier post.  It's a learned response.

Body paint - some cool art there.

eyesup

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2015, 01:49:01 AM »
Quote from: Kayaker
I'm wondering, as a point of precedence, has Spokane ever hosted a car wash with scantily clad cheerleaders for a local charity or fund raiser?

A few years ago there was a carwash here with women in bikinis doing the washing. There was a curtained off zone where, for an extra fee, you could get them to wash your car topless (the ladies not the car).

Too many oglers and giddy young men hanging around. The presumption was that the women were all hookers. As I remember the women had to be of a certain appearance, etc.

Naturally the business attracted the attention of the state, which regulates the legal sex trade here. They didn't last very long. It was started as a gimmick and didn't make enough money to pay the bills.

I'm guessing that if the clientele are naked the rules are different. I haven't followed it here but some of the strip properties, that cater to the younger high-end market, have started small limited experimenting with naked or topless pools. If they manage to keep them from getting out of hand they might become more common.

I don't have much confidence in them though. The sex business is illegal in Las Vegas so most people in that kind of work tend to be somewhat shady.

Duane

jbeegoode

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2015, 06:43:23 PM »
The strip is known as "Sin City" to much of the world and many visitors, very adult oriented, no matter how many Circus Circuses are about. People often jump to conclusions, and on the "Vegas Strip" that can at times be true. I figure that it wouldn't be a good place to garner or promote the image of free breast or nudity as wholesome.
Jbee
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eyesup

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2015, 06:35:31 AM »
It is unfortunate Jbee, but I agree with you there.

I can't tell you how many times I get asked, when traveling, "How often do you go gambling?"
People just assume that that is part of everyday life. The same holds true for the Sin City part.

I would have to sit down and do some serious thinking to remember the last time we specifically went gambling. I work hard for my money and don't like losing it. I don't mind spending it as an allocated amount for entertainment, but gambling doesn't entertain me. At all.

People that live in Denver aren't all mountain climbers. People that live in Southern California aren't all surfers. It's the same all over.

We prefer to let the tourists support the gambling business here.

Duane

nudewalker

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2015, 03:23:49 PM »
I think it's funny that for being known as "sin city" attitudes are not more relaxed. Didn't one of the hotels try to have a "European" style pool where topless sunbathing was permitted? I vaguely remember that it closed due to the behavior of drunken college students. How times have changed! We were more discrete with our drunken behavior in my day. But then we did have a place on a riverbank dubbed "Bare ass beach" where a number of us would go to party naked. Back on topic, I guess any behavior in Las Vegas such as being topless is looked on as an invitation for lewdness and not necessarily wholesome. Afteer all don't they advertise "what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas"?
"Always do what you are afraid to do"-Emerson

eyesup

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2015, 09:44:55 PM »
After reading nudewalker's last, I started a reply, which ballooned into, so far, an 800 word rant. I shall have to pare it down at a later date.

Quote from: Stuart
I do love these incredibly detailed descriptions of just how much of your body you can show or not show. Some people clearly give the subject far too much thought. "More than one-half of the part of the female breast located below the top of the areola" is one of the most anally retentive I've seen yet.

The first time I looked up the ordinances here with regard to nudity, It was odd seeing such comical anatomical lists coded into law. What I really wished for was to have been present at the city, county or state legislatures to witness the floor debates.

So many wonderful skits and movie scenes flew past. A missed opportunity!

Duane

eyesup

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2015, 06:48:35 AM »
Well it has taken over a week, but I finally am content with the content. This has been pared down from over double it's present size.

Quote from: nudewalker
I think it's funny that for being known as "sin city" attitudes are not more relaxed. Didn't one of the hotels try to have a "European" style pool where topless sunbathing was permitted? I vaguely remember that it closed due to the behavior of drunken college students. How times have changed! We were more discrete with our drunken behavior in my day. But then we did have a place on a riverbank dubbed "Bare ass beach" where a number of us would go to party naked. Back on topic, I guess any behavior in Las Vegas such as being topless is looked on as an invitation for lewdness and not necessarily wholesome. After all don't they advertise "What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas"?

Look at what you wrote, "sin city". That says basically all you need to know. That ad campaign is still used, but with a 'nod and a wink'. It implies your choice to control who knows what you did here and also the ability of the people in business to keep a lid on what actually happens here. The marketing side here just wants to imply such things not provide glaring proof of the dark underbelly that is here. The ad has always bothered me.

Yes there have been experiments with topless pools and talk of nude pools. I believe there are one or two topless pools that are part of a resort and available to their patrons. They market to young "hip" crowds and push the "fun" envelope. Problems arise with management failing to recognise the inherant issues with mixing nudity and mass quantities of alcohol. It's a business angle. They're not doing it because they're naturists or practicing nudists.

What you described in your post is what fond memories are made of. It was you and your friends having fun because of your relationships. It was all about friendship, not marketing (Yes?).

F.Y.I. with regard to the, "What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas" slogan. I was speaking to a friend of mine who knew the couple that came up with that idea. They worked for an ad company here and made a bucket of money and then began to live the fantasy they helped create. They neglected their work in favor of partying, lost their jobs at the company and ended up leaving town busted. I've heard that story many times over the years. The company, of course, still owns the ad.

Is that ironic or what?

I don't believe that this town will ever be able to market itself in any way other than what it is, has and always will be. Self-indulgent.

Duane

Bob Knows

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Re: Spokane, WA, USA, defeats proposed anti-nudity city law
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2015, 04:10:30 PM »
They market to young "hip" crowds and push the "fun" envelope. Problems arise with management failing to recognize the inherent issues with mixing nudity and mass quantities of alcohol. It's a business angle. They're not doing it because they're naturists or practicing nudists.
Duane


This is a good sign.  If there are enough young people who want to get naked so that a good "business angle" is to provide a venue for them to get naked and have fun, the so much the better for nudity in general.  I see very little down side to thousands of tourists associating good times with getting naked.  When they go back home and remember how much fun they had naked, many of them will want to get naked at home.  Most of the rest won't be offended if someone else is getting naked and having a good time at home.  I like it.

Bob


Human bodies are natural, comfortable, and green.
To see more of Bob you can view his personal photo page
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