Author Topic: A Special Spot  (Read 8852 times)

jbeegoode

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A Special Spot
« on: July 18, 2015, 09:28:08 AM »
Posted on the new site is a visit to southeastern Arizona to one of my favorite places.
http://thefreerangenaturist.org/2015/07/18/a-special-spot-trip-report/

It's been raining here. Warm monsoon rains. There is a write-up about that, too.
http://thefreerangenaturist.org/2015/07/15/waking-up-naked-in-the-rain/

Jbee
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nuduke

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2015, 12:53:31 AM »
nice report on your blog jbee!  It rained hard today at our house and I stepped out for a moment in it but it was cold & horrible and not worth getting wet for!
John

nudewalker

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2015, 03:59:06 PM »
Nice write up but I'm about sick of the rain. This is the first four day stretch without rain since May 22-26th. We broke the record for June and are well on the way for breaking it for July.
"Always do what you are afraid to do"-Emerson

jbeegoode

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2015, 07:05:41 AM »
Send it out here. After a wet eternal spring, this monsoon has been the driest in my 45 year memory so far. One or two of what we should noramlly get every day. Three weeks left of normal monsoon schedule left. Maybe the weird weather will give us a longer monsoon, like last year...maybe not.

The prickley pear pads ar shriveled, the green leaves haven't come out. I looked at some past monsoon pics last week and it was a totally different place. The San Pedro has had no blooms....
Jbee
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nudewalker

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2015, 04:06:12 PM »
If only I could Jbee, sharing the rain would be a pleasure at this point. Our round is so saturated that any localized downpour leads to flooding. We had some light showers here but thirty miles away a storm had the streets flooded. Maybe a stretch of hot humid in the forecast; in other words  perfect skinny dipping weather!
"Always do what you are afraid to do"-Emerson

eyesup

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2015, 05:29:53 AM »
Quote from: jbee
. . . monsoon has been the driest in my 45 year memory so far. . . Three weeks left of normal monsoon schedule left. Maybe the weird weather will give us a longer monsoon, like last year. . .

We have been in down turn in precipitation also. I've read that it has been going on since about 2001. Some in the meteorological field are beginning to think this is the beginning of a long term drought.

We went to Death Valley last March because of a wet spring, hoping to see a desert bloom. We spent 3 days there and saw a lot (relatively speaking) of new flowers. But by the time we got there the rains had slacked off and it didn't bloom like we were hoping.

Duane

nuduke

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2015, 09:34:58 PM »
Your map pic of lake Mead was telling, jbee. Not much water in it!
The ongoing drought in southwest USA has every sign of progressing and potentially wrecking a significant portion of the economy of the States and thereby the rest of the world.  Aren't people getting a bit panicky by now after 5 years of actual drought and a around a decade of low rain/snow?

John

jbeegoode

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2015, 11:14:18 PM »
We're used to drought in Arizona. We have a 100 year supply by law. The desert is tough. There has been a bit less rain and that rain has certainly not been to usual patterns, since 1989. California, is the one with real troubles and they use lots of water. Their usage is incongruent and political. They will be the first to go to war suing each other. They will freakout. Lake Powell is down 100 feet from the 80's. That's significant. Nevada and Arizona will be slugging it out. Nevada will have to adopt responsible growth policy.
Jbee
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nuduke

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2015, 01:38:33 AM »
I saw some very recent pics of lake Powell on a news page somewhere and was able to compare it with my holiday snaps from last year and it was significantly lower!  I hope they get plenty rain and snow this autumn winter.  I don't condone the profligate use of water I observed as just a brief visitor, and I certainly was shocked by the attitude I came across a few times which can be summarised as: 'Why should I save water, I have a right to water my garden grass, let someone else economise.  Anyway, there have been droughts before and they all went away before the water got short."  Are these people Republicans? (Sorry, joke, couldn't resist!).

What concerns me is a similarly Republican self interest.  As you all know, no doubt, the GDP of CA puts it 6th or 7th in the list of countries' GDPs.  If the CA economy takes a big dive we will all dive with it I reckon. 

Imagine if prunes and raisins became scarce and were being traded on the black market for secret, illicit eccles cake and garibaldi biscuit parties!  Imagine a garibaldi without raisins! It would be like eating a beer mat!  Anyway, seriously, the CA economy should be protected at almost all costs.  Let's hope the new San Diego desalination plant will be fit insurance.

Jbee, next time you're at the Sweat....rain dance!

By the way how's the progress of selling or saving the Sweat going?

John

jbeegoode

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2015, 03:45:59 AM »
I saw some very recent pics of lake Powell on a news page somewhere and was able to compare it with my holiday snaps from last year and it was significantly lower!  I hope they get plenty rain and snow this autumn winter.  I don't condone the profligate use of water I observed as just a brief visitor, and I certainly was shocked by the attitude I came across a few times which can be summarised as: 'Why should I save water, I have a right to water my garden grass, let someone else economise.  Anyway, there have been droughts before and they all went away before the water got short."  Are these people Republicans? (Sorry, joke, couldn't resist!).

What concerns me is a similarly Republican self interest.  As you all know, no doubt, the GDP of CA puts it 6th or 7th in the list of countries' GDPs.  If the CA economy takes a big dive we will all dive with it I reckon. 

Imagine if prunes and raisins became scarce and were being traded on the black market for secret, illicit eccles cake and garibaldi biscuit parties!  Imagine a garibaldi without raisins! It would be like eating a beer mat!  Anyway, seriously, the CA economy should be protected at almost all costs.  Let's hope the new San Diego desalination plant will be fit insurance.

Jbee, next time you're at the Sweat....rain dance!

By the way how's the progress of selling or saving the Sweat going?

John

Dang! I wrote a long reply and then pushed the wrong button and lost it!!

California’s economy
will not crash, bringing us down with it. This country is huge, and it will absorb it. Their economy is diverse and mostly urban and not dependent on water. There is money to be made selling people what it takes to use less water, restructuring, rebuilding, redesigning. I’m more concerned about my source of organic veggies and almonds, but then the farming/food providers are mostly mega-corporate with incredible clout. The economy looked at as the extremely wealthy and the regular folks become two different things. The wealthy, those with the money will hold up fine. Financial hardship because of drought might affect regular folks, but they aren’t the ones who own the majority of the wealth. They would lose home equity, property taxes, school funding, etc. This is an oligarchy, guess who wins?
 
Being from Arizona, I see California as having a long long way to go with their conservation. They still waste water.

The sweat:

We have until October to buy the sweat. There is an attempt to raise $60,000 toward $270,000. That is a price for an investor to exploit and build apartments, not a tribe of hippies looking for a spiritual gathering place. It will hurt, but maybe when money is at hand, we can invest in something much more affordable elsewhere.

I’m gathering rocks to finish the foundation. I have most of the materials already. I’ll need sweat community labor to complete a sweat out here on my property. It is a long way for many, but it is something. There are a couple of people in town with sweats that will open up in a more limited basis. I suspect that is where it is heading, but the world is full of surprises. It may become a Meetup Group. It is like here, we are TSNS, not the website. Where do we wash ashore?

Much of the labor, especially my own will be done nude. Just sayin’. ;)
Jbee
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eyesup

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2015, 08:12:25 PM »
Quote from: John
I saw some very recent pics of lake Powell on a news page somewhere and was able to compare it with my holiday snaps from last year and it was significantly lower!

Lakes Mead and Powell are both at or below 50%. There is plenty of info online if you are willing to wade through it and if you are tired but not sleepy you could read them. As to which lake gets priority for containment, there has always been a contest between those that advocate for Powell and those for Mead.

I will refrain from entering the rabbit hole conversation of unrestrained growth and blinkered politicians that are husbanded by developers. That discussion always deteriorates into a political one.

Quote
which can be summarised as: 'Why should I save water, I have a right to water my garden and grass, let someone else economise.

Believe it or not, there are towns in California where there is no water bill! Water is provided by the community and people just use it! I am assuming it's paid out of taxes. They have had so many years of abundant, or should I say free, water no one understands conservation. There are also communities that have grandfather agreements and they aren't about to release them. Can't blame them for that, I guess, but it illustrates the irresponsible attitudes people have had there for decades.

Quote
Anyway, there have been droughts before and they all went away before the water got short.

That is true in the long term. The question is how long before the rain returns. It can be shown to be true, based on current data. Tree ring and ice core data, however, show that there have been major (decades and centuries long) droughts in this area. These pre-date most industrial impacts. There is some discussion, I've seen, that the scientific community is cautiously asking whether we might be entering another one of these megadrought cycles. Population out here west of the Rockies, excluding California, is closing in on 50 million.

Type in "prehistoric megadrought" to Google and you will get a downpour of info.

Quote
If the CA economy takes a big dive we will all dive with it I reckon.

Anyway, seriously, the CA economy should be protected at almost all costs.

It is true that California is a large economy, but if it tanked, someone would be there with resources to pick up great bargains at fire-sale prices. It's the nature of a market economy. Lots of short term pain though.

I am uncomfortable with designating anything human designed as "too important to fail". Politicians love to throw this one about. It protects their bottom line just as much as it does a company and/or a state or municipal government. It also negates the process of competition that generates improvements in the market.

It's basically giving someone 'Carte blance'. With no consequences to keep them in check, it's also an irresponsible game to play.

Quote
Let's hope the new San Diego desalination plant will be fit insurance.

Desalinization is probably the future. It will force people to realize how expensive clean water is becoming. The technology is available and has been for years. Cities just aren't willing because of how much it costs. Drawing from aquifers has reached a tipping point, from a line between Texas to North Dakota west they are being depleted faster than they are being replenished.

Precipitation and snow-pack is down for many years running. As you can see, any discussion about water here in the west requires that you talk about the Golden Elephant. We may not have a choice in the matter.

It is, contrary to what some advocate groups will tell you, not only about global warming. There are multiple processes and events at play. Water politics out here have been cut-throat for years and aren't about to change soon.

Duane

jbeegoode

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2015, 10:48:29 PM »
Lack of water makes people jump, and get weird, like no other issue that I know. I was on a community well a few years back, with 7 families and one well. It would occasionally in the dry time of year require supplements. People doing new wells upstream began to make it work horribly. They put in a golf course, promising to not use ground water, but did. That's stealing with a huge effect on people's lives.


There were meetings amongst the people on our well. "You use too much." "Try to stop me."You don't have the money for improvements, but you can buy a new car." We called the meetings Water Wars. People began to get off of the community well. Hard feelings effected out community fabric. We got meters and to pay our fair share according to use. One couple actually bypassed the meter on the sly. They were hated by the others for washing their car. >:( It got very weird.


There is nothing like having your shower suddenly stop with soap in your hair, right before rushing to work, that will create a sense of.... ;D

I am now independent of that system. Two families are left on the old well. I'm using a fraction of what "normal" people use and with a garden and a good hot shower. I recognize that I live in a desert. I'd predict that if the screws were to be put into California's water use, that there would be some unimaginably ugly shenanigans everywhere. What was that Jack Nicholson movie in the 80's?  8) Chinatown? What would happen then, would pale in comparison to the situations, now.

Of course, from my perspective, the average Californian is a water glutton with much to learn and my sympathy is minimal at best.  :'(

De Anza had conserve water signs everywhere. Unless fires burn down the freerange habitats, or unscrupulous politics destroy the riparian areas more than they already have, or people move from CA to the adjacent states like they already are and destroy free range habitat, or also decide to change the prevailing social fabric, this discussion is irrelevant to our way of life and the website.

I was just trying to ease Nuduke's mind.
Jbee

P. S. People actually get all you can use free water?!??! Inconceivable? It does not compute! My brain may explode! Surely this can not be real????
« Last Edit: July 31, 2015, 10:52:59 PM by jbeegoode »
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eyesup

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2015, 08:08:36 AM »
Quote
I was just trying to ease Nuduke's mind.
Sorry Jbee, for going off like that. My brain starts to hurt when I hear this stuff. I think you and I are on the same side of the fence on the water issue.

Quote from: Jbee
P. S. People actually get all you can use free water?!??! Inconceivable? It does not compute! My brain may explode! Surely this can not be real?

I do not lie! I only heard of this recently. I couldn't believe it either.

I saw it on a news report awhile back about the drought. Some of these water rights and use treaties go back to the 17th and 18th century. Allocations that made sense back then DO NOT make sense now. There's almost 40 million people in the state. That puts California (37.3 million) right behind Poland (38.3 million) and ahead of Canada (35.5 million).

Free Water
Grandfather Rights

Stuart, Karla, I apologize. I will shut up now.

Duane

nudewalker

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2015, 02:45:21 PM »
For many years much of the water around here was not useable due to pollution. In fact there are still warnings about how much fish you should eat out of a few rivers. I also remember when the river in Cleveland Ohio caught on fire! It's funny now that we have political people come to town and decry all the EPA controls since they never lived under those conditions.

But back to California's problem; my daughter told me of corporations buying up land with water rights that will eventually sell water as a commodity to what will become the highest bidder. Attitudes will have to change as long as this drought continues; pre conceived ideas of water usage will doom many. Speaking of which didn't a nudist resort get accused of stealing water? Also some star also sending water trucks to get water for his ranch from a local fire hydrant? Chinatown in the near future? Maybe!
"Always do what you are afraid to do"-Emerson

jbeegoode

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Re: A Special Spot
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2015, 10:21:20 PM »
Halburton and ... ah, the guys who build most of the nuclear plants...Bechtel...escapes me right now... are buying up water all over the world. That control is big profit in the future when taken from the people's government hands. Just look at the big pharm's ways with drugs to see the future.
Jbee
« Last Edit: August 02, 2015, 10:21:33 AM by jbeegoode »
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