Author Topic: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)  (Read 12274 times)

ric

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #45 on: July 07, 2017, 10:51:02 AM »
got to agree with the belt/tight clothing  bit.   even sitting rigidly upright in a chair folds the digestive tract and stops it working properly.
wife and kids always grumble after ive driven their cars .... i always recline the seat back a couple of notches,  otherwise i get gut ache on long journeys ,   then they also moan if i undo trouser waistband whilst driving... no ive not broached the subject of naked driving , somethings are best kept hidden from the kids.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2017, 10:53:39 AM by ric »

ric

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #46 on: July 07, 2017, 12:48:13 PM »
a lot of (99% ?) of the lifestyle and dietry advice weve been given over the last 50 odd years is either simplistic,  aimed at promoting a product, or directly oposite to the advice given out last month.

decades ago we were told that butter and red meat was bad for us , millions have been spent on research to prove it... totally unsucessfully, weve still got heart diseease and cancer despite the charities asking for money to fund research cos theyll find a cure next year.

the mediteranean diet was touted as the wonder diet ... when you look at the one study it was based on , it was fundamentally flawed ... data from countries that contradicted the conclusions was excluded.... even the basic beleif that country populations were vegetarian was gathered in the aftermath of a world ware where all the livestock had been stolen by the occupying army.

recent years weve had the 5 a day fruit and veg thing... its well known that the 5 was invented on the way to a conference by an "expert" with nothing to say in their speech...with little thought and  based on no research whatsoever

the hunzas are now touted as the model of a vegetarian population , but whats not often considered is they are an isolated population in a remote mountain valley,  little genetic input /social interaction from outside, the peoples genetics and metabolism have had hundreds /thousands of years to develope to suit that diet and that environment and lifestyle.... drop in say a traditional eskimo used to seal / whale meat etc i doubt hed have a long healthy life on the hunza diet.... let alone a burger chomping coke swilling "civilised" man. 
sorry man should probably be person but im not very pc.

Bob Knows

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #47 on: July 07, 2017, 02:30:24 PM »
- even washing it down with BEER doesn't help ...
Peter


What?   Beer has been the healthy drink for hundreds of years. 

OK, skip the processed food.  Just drink the beer.

Bob
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Davie

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #48 on: July 07, 2017, 02:59:43 PM »
I was advised by a doctor that beer is good, helps to hydrate. Off course too much is another story. It's also good from a social and mental point of view. Man does not live by bread alone! I hope to have a couple of pints of good old English ale this evening and to hell with the prophets of doom!

Davie  8)

jbeegoode

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #49 on: July 07, 2017, 05:24:22 PM »
a lot of (99% ?) of the lifestyle and dietry advice weve been given over the last 50 odd years is either simplistic,  aimed at promoting a product, or directly oposite to the advice given out last month.

decades ago we were told that butter and red meat was bad for us , millions have been spent on research to prove it... totally unsucessfully, weve still got heart diseease and cancer despite the charities asking for money to fund research cos theyll find a cure next year.

the mediteranean diet was touted as the wonder diet ... when you look at the one study it was based on , it was fundamentally flawed ... data from countries that contradicted the conclusions was excluded.... even the basic beleif that country populations were vegetarian was gathered in the aftermath of a world ware where all the livestock had been stolen by the occupying army.

recent years weve had the 5 a day fruit and veg thing... its well known that the 5 was invented on the way to a conference by an "expert" with nothing to say in their speech...with little thought and  based on no research whatsoever

the hunzas are now touted as the model of a vegetarian population , but whats not often considered is they are an isolated population in a remote mountain valley,  little genetic input /social interaction from outside, the peoples genetics and metabolism have had hundreds /thousands of years to develope to suit that diet and that environment and lifestyle.... drop in say a traditional eskimo used to seal / whale meat etc i doubt hed have a long healthy life on the hunza diet.... let alone a burger chomping coke swilling "civilised" man. 
sorry man should probably be person but im not very pc.
Amen! It is a bitch to try to sort "the experts" out.

Eat good fresh food, the best most nutritious food...naked. At least that is an obvious conclusion. Washing it down with BEER seems to work for many people. Good nutritious processed with love and respect.
Jbee
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JOhnGw

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #50 on: July 07, 2017, 09:42:36 PM »
......... Washing it down with BEER seems to work for many people. Good nutritious processed with love and respect.
Jbee
BEER is good but not the chemical products purveyed under the same name by the multinationals.
JOhn

Do not do unto others as you would that they should do unto you. Their tastes may not be the same.
George Bernard Shaw, Maxims for Revolutionaries

eyesup

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #51 on: July 08, 2017, 12:38:09 AM »
There is more energy per gram of meat than vegetables. There are more vitamins in veggies than meats. Iron and protein are more plentiful in meat. The higher capacity for meat to deliver more nutrition per unit weight makes it the fastest way to get that. It doesnít necessarily make it better, just faster.

Cooking advances the process so the human digestive tract can work more efficiently. It all boils ;) down to how much effort and energy you want to spend on hunter gathering. Itís not about which is better per se, itís about time allocation. Less time spent surviving means more time to spend on innovations.

Duane

eyesup

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #52 on: July 08, 2017, 12:40:58 AM »
I remember that at one time motherís milk was bad, bacon was bad, coffee was bad, et.al. infinitum. Over time they figure out that there is no singular culprit or champion when it comes to metabolism, nutrition, DNA and breeding. There seems to be a benefit, in different measures, no matter the food being discussed.

The whole field of study about free radicals, not the political kind, and antioxidants has a great deal to do with how diet affects your health. Some is good, too much is bad. Itís getting too complicated to just look for a good hero. :)

The more information that is compiled, the better the big picture is filled in. Anyone claiming to be an authority is to be under suspicion of fraud immediately.

Duane

eyesup

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #53 on: July 08, 2017, 12:44:48 AM »
Quote from: Jbee
It is a bitch to try to sort "the experts" out.
Itís actually not that hard.
An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made in a very narrow field.
- Niels Bohr


Anyone with that track record should be listened to only long enough to determine they are in fact an expert.

Duane

JOhnGw

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #54 on: July 08, 2017, 07:07:58 AM »
On a brief working trip to Beijing the executive secretary who was acting as my interpreter pointed out that while in China they consider the ways in which each food is good for you, in the west it is why each food is bad that is considered.
JOhn

Do not do unto others as you would that they should do unto you. Their tastes may not be the same.
George Bernard Shaw, Maxims for Revolutionaries

jbeegoode

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #55 on: July 08, 2017, 11:28:55 AM »
There is more energy per gram of meat than vegetables. There are more vitamins in veggies than meats. Iron and protein are more plentiful in meat. The higher capacity for meat to deliver more nutrition per unit weight makes it the fastest way to get that. It doesnít necessarily make it better, just faster.

Cooking advances the process so the human digestive tract can work more efficiently. It all boils ;) down to how much effort and energy you want to spend on hunter gathering. Itís not about which is better per se, itís about time allocation. Less time spent surviving means more time to spend on innovations.

Duane
Iron is more plentiful in many veggies than meats, most notable famous example, Popeye's spinach, but there are many more. Good fresh veggies, which are live and living have been given a bad rap by the meat industry propaganda. There is a ton of protein in veggies, too. Often more than meats. When you consider the overcooking to get rid of the factory farm defects and dangers, the nutritional benefits cooked are nothing like the raw product. Veggie nutrition also disappears 40% and 60% and more cooked. A couple of days after picking and there is dramatic reduction, too. Simply grinding, squeezing, and blending, will reduce the intake time of mastication. Meat doesn't digest as well. There isn't as much fiber.

There is also an obvious difference when eating fresh and raw. Much less is consumed before satisfaction. The food is enjoyed more and chewed more mindfully. There is a tendency to eat cooked foods by more of a shoveling style in various amounts. The heat makes one eat it before it gets colder, so one eats faster and greater quantities. The reason for the lesser intake is because the body knows that it is getting its nutritional needs, it isn't searching for more by eating more to get satisfied.

Meat taste fun, it lays me out satisfied in big quantities, but it isn't necessary and overuse generally isn't so good, without lots of exercise and plenty of veggie fiber.

We aren't hunter gatherers anymore. We have had a balanced domestic animal and farming success,  which is being destroyed
by a very greedy unscrupulous group of corporate pirates. We have the resources to feed a much greater population than the Earth has now using local smaller farm methods. Creating domestic meat is many times less efficient to the point of doing massive environmental harm and harm to other humans. These new factory farm methods also have ethical questions, like gruesome lifetime of torture, which isn't necessary and instead gives superior products. Meat, is just an overused bad habit making trouble in epic proportions.

The meat industry has placed this idea of a body needing massive protein on us. People actually don't need a diet that is mostly protein. Some people need more than others according to Aruvedic medicine, but nothing like we have been told. China Study showed the overwhelming evidence of that. Even so, there is more protein to be had in veggies, not even considering plant sources like beans and nuts.

Hmm, I suppose I disagree with you Duane.... ;) ;D

Less meat eating, more fantastic places to hike naked.
Jbee
Barefoot all over, all over.

Peter S

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #56 on: July 08, 2017, 11:34:23 AM »
Quote
...  in China they consider the ways in which each food is good for you, in the west it is why each food is bad that is considered.

I suspect that reflects the Chinese peasant farming tradition compared with our industrial food production system which grows what's easiest to grow and then wraps it in plastic before overcharging us for it ....

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Motorcycling, history, country hiking,
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ric

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #57 on: July 08, 2017, 04:56:10 PM »
theres no argument that the peasant farmer growing vegetables  and possibly keeping chickens and pigs is the most efficient use of land area there are places where the topography or lack of water wont allow that intensive cultivation,  ideal country for free range animals , cattle. sheep, goats or whatever.

Bob Knows

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #58 on: July 08, 2017, 06:23:16 PM »
I remember that at one time motherís milk was bad, bacon was bad, coffee was bad, et.al. infinitum. Over time they figure out that there is no singular culprit or champion when it comes to metabolism, nutrition, DNA and breeding. There seems to be a benefit, in different measures, no matter the food being discussed.
Duane


I recently saw a news article saying that 50 years of "medical" teaching everyone about cholesterol, saturated fats, etc, was totally bogus.  All my life I've been reading about "healthy" diets and foods, and in 20 years its something else.  99% of it turns out to be marketing bullshit for over priced or "yuppie" foods and quack medical "treatment."

Most of it does more harm than good. 

The primary benefit is to separate people from their money.  As P.T.Barnum said, "A fool and his money are easily separated." 

Bob
 

Human bodies are natural, comfortable, and green.
To see more of Bob you can view his personal photo page
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eyesup

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Re: Medical evidence or (Who didn't know this?)
« Reply #59 on: July 08, 2017, 10:00:56 PM »
Yep!
Too much research too narrowly focused on a singular agenda.

Duane